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the logs to the mill. How much does it cost to log these small and low grade logs, compared with the average cost figures of logging?

Where the lumbering is jobbed out, it would appear to cost no more, but jobbers do guess at this factor of increased cost and demand more for the job than where only the high grades are coming out. Again we come to the factor of average and overhead. If the small low grade logs are not taken out, all the overhead must be charged to those logs which are taken out. this overhead cost taken care of, does it cost more or less than our average cost figures for any given job to remove these smaller logs? We can all make our guess. Who knows? I am going to find out if I can.

OTHER USES FOR WASTE Now lumber is only one of the possible things we can work this waste into. I don't like to call this material “waste" until I find that it cannot be manufactured into lumber at a profit, because, to my mind, a thing is not waste if it can be manufactured-brought to a mill and manufactured into an article of merchandise at a profit. So, when I use that term “waste," don't come back at me.

Lumber is not the only material into which it may be possible to manufacture these logs with profit. There are railroad ties, mill flooring, hoe handles, chemical wood and I don't know what allthat this material can go into. Now I believe, before we know whether any of those logs are merchantable, before we can know what the merchantable value of those small, crooked, defective logs is for manufacturing purposes, we have got to get at cost figures similar to those I have been talking about,-- not only for

but for all these other possible products that this material can be manufactured into.

That is a big task-more than one year's work; but, by degrees, I believe that data can be collected and worked together, and that we can know-not guess but know what the actual cost figures are. Furthermore I believe that we can have them in such form that ve can convert them into present cost even under changing conditions.

Now you may think I am talking about an impossible situation. I believe it is a big task; I believe it is a big proposition, but nevertheless I believe it is possible, and I believe that we have got to have that kind of information about logs and about markets and about manufacturing.

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I thank you, gentlemen.

to decide

out in a spirit of co-operation. I am interested only in the economic problems that you are interested in, and I want the data to be

THE TOASTMASTER: I think we all appreciate the talk which Professor Chandler has given us. It is an intensely practical one,

DEVELOPING A MARKET Of course it is self-evident and axiomatic that we must look up all the possible markets for all this material. Nobody wants

certain kind of log can be worked into a certain product without knowing, from the best cost data we can collect, that it will cost just so much to work it into that product and that there is an assured margin of profit in it. Then again it may be that, although there is a certain margin of profit assured, as shown by those figures, the market may be so smail that it will be flooded if a man here and a man there and a man somewhere else goes into manufacturing it. That, of course, must also be taken into consideration. If a man has got a good though small market, for pity's sake

What we want to do is to find other things that can be manufactured from that kind and amount of logs,-or else to find the things that have such a big market that a lot of us can manufacture them without creating an over supply. Nobody wants to flood a good but small market. That would be a great mistake and nobody wants to do that.

Now, as I said in the beginning, those are some of the things I have been thinking about and working on.

I realize that the greater part of them cannot be worked out except in co-operation with you men who have got plants and mills and are interested

I believe that we ought to work these things

let him have it.

in these matters.

used in no way that will in any way interfere with your economic



and some of us who are engaged in logging and manufacturing forest products will be much interested in studying the address as it is printed in our record here. It is something that needs very careful consideration on the part of the logger and the manufacturer, and I am quite sure, Professor Chandler, you will find that these men who are engaged in logging and manufacturing will respond to your suggestions and assist in developing these studies that are so very valuable and important to us.


H. LEROY AUSTIN UNABLE TO BE PRESENT Mr. Austin, who was to address us this evening, telegraphed this afternoon that he had been called to New York on an important professional engagement. He is an attorney for the New York Central Railroad Company at Albany. He expresses his regret that he cannot be here. Now I am going to close this meeting by asking a friend of mine whom I have been pleased to see here today to make a few miscellaneous remarks.

Mr. Ernest A. Sterling, a forester and engineer of standing in the profession and a director of the American Forestry Association for a number of years—and an active one—and at the present time associated with the firm of James D. Lacey & Company of Chicago, which firm you all know as brokers, bankers and financiers in forestry matters,—is here, and it is a personal pleasure to ask him to speak for a few moments on any subject that occurs to him as being of interest to us. (Applause.)



moment is a piece of comparison,-not an odious one but one which will help you in your problems here. I refer to the relation of ample supply they cannot talk as much in detail as you are able

In considering the standing timber supply of the United States, dwindling supply and high demand. Therefore you have reached




JAMES D. LACEY & Co. MR. ERNEST A. STERLING: Mr. President and Gentlemen: I feel that I am a very poor substitute for Mr. Austin, and I will be exceedingly brief. When President Ostrander sent for me today, through a bellboy, I supposed of course he wanted to place an order for a couple of million feet of Pacific Coast lumber. When I found what he wanted of me was to tell me he wanted me to substitute for Mr. Austin, I had to come down to earth. (Laughter.)

I am mighty glad to be here, because I feel I have come back home. My early days in the woods were in Pennsylvania and the

I know practically all you gentlemen, and to come back to the East and hear the problems of New York State discussed is a real pleasure and a personal satisfaction, and I want to say that they have been most interestingly and intelligently discussed here today and this evening.

Now the thing that will perhaps interest you most for just a of New York State and its forest problems to the other forest problems of the country. This is all an economic proposition, as you know.

You have been talking forest economics here, which constitute the big problems all over the country; but in the regions to here. starting with Maine, there is a fair supply there yet; but decreasing through New England and the Middle States of New York and Pennsylvania, and then gradually increasing again as we go out west.

In other words, you are here in a center practically of a point of comparatively high stumpage values and an active market for your products, both for the standard form of products and for the by-products and the re-manufactures, and you have therefore a condition existing practically nowhere else except perhaps in New England and have a very good reason indeed and a very

good incentive for going into the study of some of these things which have been suggested, with the idea of carrying them out at as early a date as is practicable.

For a group of lumbermen, such as you are, to get together and fraternize and discuss these forestry problems and talk about forest replacement and so on is certainly stimulating to anyone who has the future of our forests at heart. You will have the pleasure of working out the solution of these problems in this regard, and, though the realization of such plans will be a long ways off, you are working in the right direction.

I could tell you many interesting things, by way of comparison of what you are up against with conditions existing further west, but I will not take your time to do it now. The essential thing is, you are working along the right lines and I wish you all success in your endeavors.

FUTURE DEPENDS ON PUBLICITY Of particular interest to me, because of my association in the last three years, is your problem of publicity here. Your future, as I see it, depends quite largely on publicity; but, strangely enough, it is a different kind of publicity from what some of the other lumbermen of the country have to consider. In our case out west, and also in the south, it is a question of publicity to create a demand for our lumber and wood, to take care of the surplus which our people have. Over-production has been the problem in the south and west. Here, publicity required is along a different line entirely. You are endeavoring to find the supplies, rather than markets, generally speaking.

So you have a problem of publicity which is local to New York and New England perhaps, but with your present organization, and with a forester in your association now, you are well equipped for the tackling of this mighty interesting and big problem which you have to work out.

The future of your remaining timber here is a great problem. It was only sixteen or seventeen years ago that your Adirondack hardwoods were practically worthless and had no market value. They have now come up until they command a good stumpage price, and you are manufacturing all sorts of products from them and realizing that you have something of value in them. How much farther they will go up in value no one can say, but with re-manufactures and special products and special markets and publicity you can probably carry this farther and make your present hardwood stumpage worth more than it is today.

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