ap

ten or printed the word "approved" or "disapproved" and if a majority of all the ballots cast in said cities shall be so written or printed proved," then this act shall take effect as in the first section thereof is provided; but if the majority of such ballots shall be printed or written "disapproved," then this act shall be of no effect.

I ask that this amendment may be printed. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The school bill has passed from the consideration of the Senate, and the Post Office appropriation bill is now before the body, but if there be no objection this amendment will be printed.

Mr. FERRY, of Connecticut. I shall offer it when the school bill comes up again, and I wish to have it printed in the mean time. The PRESIDING OFFICER. will be entered.

Mr. WINDOM rose.

That order

Mr. SUMNER. I hope the Senator will allow this bill to be proceeded with to the end. Mr. WINDOM. If a vote can be taken I will not object.

Mr. SUMNER. I think there will be very little discussion.

Mr. WINDOM. If it is to be further discussed I must insist on the appropriation bill.

Mr. SUMNER. If I supposed it was to occupy much time I should not ask the Senator to yield, but he will see that we have taken this bill up now two or three times, and I ask him if it is expedient that we should be obliged to take it up again?

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Massachusetts asks that by unanimous consent the appropriation bill may be laid aside for the purpose of continuing the consideration of the school bill.

Mr. FERRY, of Connecticut. I propose to discuss that bill. I have submitted an amendment which I wish to have printed.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Connecticut objects.

Mr. SUMNER. Is that in the nature of an objection? The Senator says he will disVery well.

cuss it.

Mr. VICKERS. I object.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Maryland objects.

Mr. CASSERLY. I have the greatest respect for the Senator from Massachusetts, but it seems to me he ought to understand by this time that this bill of his is destined to have a very thorough discussion in this body.

Mr. SUMNER. Very well; then is it not better that it should go on now?

Mr. CASSERLY. But I appeal to the Senator whether he should undertake to force it through in this manner over the appropriation bill already pending?

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Maryland objects to the further laying aside of the appropriation bill, and the school bill cannot be proceeded with without a vote.

Mr. SUMNER. I appeal, then, to the Senator from Minnesota to allow the bill that has been under consideration to-day to be proceeded with to the end. We have commenced it; the plow is in the furrow; and let us go on.

Mr. WINDOM. It is not in my power I believe to consent to anything of the sort.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Maryland objected, and the school bill can only be taken up by laying the appropriation bill on the table.

Mr. SUMNER. It is in the power of the Senator to put aside this bill for the present.

Mr. WINDOM. It is in the power of the Senate, not in my power. I hope, however, the Senate will complete this appropriation bill, which has been under consideration two or three days. I do not feel at liberty to consent to let it go over.

POST OFFICE APPROPRIATION BILL.

The Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the consideration of the bill (H. R. No. 1070) making appropriations for the ser

vice of the Post Office Department for the year ending June 30, 1873, the pending question being on the amendment of the Committee on Appropriations, in section four, line twentysix, to strike out one hundred and fifty" and insert four hundred;" so as to make the clause read, "for steamship service between the United States and Brazil, $400,000;" and to insert after "dollars" the following clause:

And the Postmaster General is hereby directed to increase the mail service with Brazil now in operation under the act approved May 28, 1864, so as to provide for deliveries of the mails in New York and Rio de Janeiro twice each month; and he shall require said semi-monthly service to be performed by steamships wholly constructed in the United States (two of which shall be of not less than two thousand five hundred tons burden, and the others of not less than two thousand tons burden) for the term of years provided by the former contract; and the Government of the United States shall have the right, in case of war, to take any of said vessels for its own use upon payment of a reasonable compensation therefor: Provided, That the expense of the service shall be divided between the Governments of Brazil and of the United States; and that the United States portion thereof shall not exceed $400,000 for service twice performed per month.

Mr. WINDOM. In conformity with the action of the Senate yesterday, or at least in partial conformity therewith, I offer a substitute for the amendment printed in the bill. It is to strike out all after the word "Brazil," in line twenty-six, and to insert in lieu thereof the following:

Four hundred and fifty thousand dollars. And the Postmaster General is hereby directed to increase the mail service with Brazil, now in operation under the act approved May 28, 1864, so as to provide for deliveries of the mails at New York and Rio de Janeiro twice each month, and in the contract therefor he shall require said semimonthly service to be performed for the term of years provided by the original contract, and by steamships wholly constructed in the United States, two of which shall be of not less than twenty-five hundred tons burden, and the others of not less than two thousand tons burden, all of which shall be officered by citizens of the United States or those who have declared their intention to become citizens; and the contractors shall be required to carry the United States mails, without extra charge, on all the steamers they may run on said line, or any part of it, or any branch or extension thereof: Provided, That all steamships hereafter accepted for said service shall be constructed so as to be readily adapted to the armed naval service of the United States in time of war; and before acceptance the officers by whom they may be inspected shall report to the Secretary of the Navy and the Postmaster General whether this condition has been complied with; and the Government shall have the right, in case of war, to take any of said vessels for its own use upon payment of a reasonable compensation therefor: Provided further, That the entire cost to the United States of said service performed twice each month shall not exceed $450,000 per annum.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair understands that the order adopted yesterday limiting debate to five minutes is still in force to-day.

Mr. CHANDLER. I notice that while the service is doubled by this amendment the pay is trebled; that is to say, at present $150,000 is paid for a monthly service, and the committee propose to pay $450,000 for a semimonthly service. I should like to know the reason why the committee do not insist upon treble the service if they treble the pay.

Mr. WINDOM. The Senator from Louisiana [Mr. WEST] has charge of this amend ment, and he will doubtless answer the ques

tion.

Mr. WEST. I did not distinctly hear the Senator from Michigan, and I should like him to repeat his question.

Mr. CHANDLER. I stated that the pay now for monthly service is $150,000 a year. This amendment proposes to double the service, that is to give a semi-monthly line instead of a monthly, and to treble the pay. In other words, it would be $300,000 if they doubled the pay and doubled the service, but they double the service and treble the pay. They raise the pay from $150,000 to $450,000 and only double the service.

Mr. WEST. The particular answer to the Senator from Michigan, and it is one that if he

will recall it to his recollection, his experience here will remind himself of, is that the original contract for the service was a joint contract made as between the Government of Brazil and the Government of the United States; that is to say, under the act of May 28, 1864, establishing this service, it was stipulated and agreed that it should be jointly borne by the two Governments, but that in no event should the charge upon the Government of the United States exceed $150,000. The Government of Brazil, as I am informed, has contributed to this line a subsidy of $100,000 per annum, making the total compensation to the company $250,000. The agreement as between the Government of Brazil and this company expires in a very few years, within three years, as I am informed, and there has been such objection made by other companies who are not put on the same footing as the American company has been as to make it out of the question for Brazil to advance a similar compensation or proceed in the same ratio in the future service. Now, had the Senator who sits adjacent to the honorable chairman of the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads called upon him for the very exhaustive and able report that committee has made within a few days, setting forth all the facts in connec tion with this service, it would hardly have been necessary for him to ask the question. That report goes on to show that at the present time we have a very imperfect service in connection with the Brazilian ports; that the trips are necessarily so long that it is out of the question to derive the full advantage from them that would be derived if they were more continuous or more repeated.

However, I will not enter upon that matter. I will refer the Senator to the report, but I have answered his question, that the semimonthly service which is now proposed must of necessity be entirely borne by the Government of the United States on account of the conflict of the provision with the usages accorded to other nations by the Brazilian Gov

ernment.

Mr. STEWART. I should like to inquire of the Senator if that report is a lengthy one.

Mr. WEST. No, sir. Some of it might be omitted, but if it should be read, and if the Senate would give attention to the reading, it would save a great deal of debate.

Mr. STEWART. I should like to hear the report read.

The Chief Clerk read the following report made by Mr. RAMSEY, from the committee, on the 26th of April:

The Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, to whom were referred the memorial and supplementary memorial of the United States and Brazil Mail Steamship Company respectfully report:

That mail steamship service to Brazil was inaugurated under act of Congress approved May 28, 1864. Brazil had agreed to bear part of the expense, thus preferring the United States to all other nations. The Postmaster General attests the fidelity of service under the contract, but he states that the route is too long for monthly service; that under the best possible schedule of running the outgoing steamer must leave New York two days after the arrival of the incoming steamer. As neither letters, nor remittances, nor shipments under commercial orders can be prepared in this limited time, and as they cannot await thirty-two days for the next departure from New York, they necessarily fall into British steamers. Our people, deprived of the reciprocal opportunities for exchange of commodities, lose the main benefits contemplated when this service was begun. The Postmaster General urges double service as a practical necessity. The contractors offer to bind themselves to perform this for a moderate mail pay. They state that they have paid $4,000,000 in gold for duty on coffee imported by their steamers, besides increasing the trade largely in divers ways. They offer proof that owing to disjointed service they have, in seven years. (although they have paid nothing for insurance,) not earned, altogether, five per cent.; in other words, have barely managed to keep out of debt. They are confident that double service will secure a large export trade. If they are refused this, they ask to be released from their contract. They are known to be able and economical managers. The route is therefore presented practically, on both sides, as one capable of yielding great public benefits with adequate service. The alternative seems to be semi-monthly steamship service or no steamship service whatever.

Petitions have been received by the committee

from some of the most important commercial and moneyed interests in the land asking for extension of this service. As a postal route, the Postmaster General states that it is very imperfect at present, and a majority of the letters" go via England. In the fiscal year 1869-70 we exchanged with Brazil by American steamers 166,000 letters, yielding over twenty thousand dollars. With British opportunities constantly increasing, and with no increase of our own, these receipts must be diminished; but it is claimed that to double the American service will immediately treble this amount.

In a national and commercial point of view the entire people of the United States feel the deepest interest in the Brazil trade. We are dependent on Brazil for almost a necessary of life, importing thence annually two hundred and fifty million pounds of coffee. We are the largest single consumer of her produce. We should pay for this, if not with manufacturers, with our produce and provisions. The route is in American waters. In last fiscal year we exported to Brazil the value of $5,945,307. We imported thence $30,560,468. The imports and exports of Great Britain in the same trade balance each other. They now seek to do more-to cut off our exports by triangular voyages, going direct to Brazil from Great Britain and returning via New

York. By perfect transportation they defeat the laws of nature. We consume twice as much coffee as England, but she exports to Brazil between six and seven time as much value as we do. France is not far behind her in exports. Brazil and contiguous markets purchase $150,000,000 of imported articles; but they buy naturally from those who can furnish them at a stated early time. There is not a nation of Europe indifferent to this trade. Few nations are untaxed by their efforts to secure it. Nature offers a large portion of it to the United States, but the efforts of other nations exact from us the highest class of transportation. France alone pays over five hundred thousand dollars currency per annum (2,306,172 francs) for mail service, (monthly, we believe.)'

We find much of interest on this point in the dispatches of Mr. Blow, United States minister to Brazil. (Senate Document 92, Forty-First Congress, second session.) "While we have been paying gold almost entirely for our coffee to Brazil, other nations more remote buy almost entirely with their manufactured goods and produce," simply because their early efforts were directed to establishing close and rapid communication by every means in their power." Again, he says, our produce and manufac

tures

are now needed at remunerative prices, but are kept back for the want of regular and fair transportation." "A people paying $60,000,000 per annum for an article so essential as coffee have a right to demand the most enlightened legislation in regard to it." "Almost every day some splendid steamer arrives with every article needed by the people of Brazil from England and continental European ports." "We have a steamer once a month, while a dozen three-thousand ton steamers would soon be fully employed." The greatest need of the masses of Brazil is bread, and as they become accustomed to flour and corn the consumption of their mandioca will decline.

"The production of coffee can be increased in quantity more readily than of sugar and cotton.

"The fact stares us in the face that the consumption of coffee, even at the high price it has commanded and at the high duty it has paid, has increased so rapidly in the United States [Mr. Blow dates doubtless from 1865] as to threaten us with a rate where it will cease to be within the reach of the masses of our people, who regard it as a necessity." In confirmation of this, it is certain that in 1870 the consumption of coffee exceeded the importation. The production of coffee, estimated by Mr. Blow to be five hundred million pounds in 1870, was fifteen million three hundred and twelve thousand pounds in 1820, having been multiplied thirty-three times in fifty years.

Four millions of emancipated negroes are being added gradually to our coffee consumers, and our need of coffee is not likely to diminish. Any policy which will cheapen coffee will benefit our people at large. They consume annually over seven pounds per capita. Each cent per pound saved in price represents near three million dollars saved to them. Increased scope of business will be followed by greater interchanges of products, and, of course, by lower freights and increased importations. In this way the price will be reduced. The importations of coffee for some years after the establishment of the Brazil line of steamers averaged annually one hundred million pounds, more than for some years previous. In 1865 two hundred and thirty-eight vessels from Brazil entered our ports. In fiscal year 1870-71 the entries were five hundred and five, to that through limited imperfect intercourse the tonnage has more than doubled in five years. The last fiscal year shows seventy vessels more than 1869-70. But there is another side of the picture. With inferior transportation we cannot command remittances sailing vessels available to fetch and carry can no longer command commerce. Certainty and speed are needed. There was cleared for Brazil in 1869-70 the number of two hundred and ninety-seven vessels; in 1870-71 the number was two hundred and eighty-eight. A decrease of nine in clearances, an inerease of seventy in entries, present significant facts. In 1859 our clipper ships were supreme on the ocean, in this trade, at least. Brazil then afforded a market for five hundred thousand barrels of flour. In fiscal year 1870-71 our shipments were considerably less; we believe in calendar year 1871 they were less by one fourth.

The following table presents other articles of ex

Our total contribution of the articles named amounts to a little more than one dollar in $100 of her imports at two ports only.

It is stated that nearly one hundred thousand tons of British steamers ply between English and South American ports; certainly the mere increase of British exports to Brazil, between 1867 and 1869, was over seven million dollars, a sum largely exceeding our entire exports. There is another important feature in this trade. Our Government allows an abatement of duty on coffee damaged on arrival. There are returns at the Treasury from the principal ports as follows, for the year 1871, calendar duty at three cents per pound; with former duty of five cents per pound, the same percentage of damage would represent two thirds more money: Allowances, in gold, for damages on coffee imported by sailing vessels:

Or, at fifteen per cent., in currency, over one hundred and ninety-one thousand dollars.

The allowances for damages by steamer, same period, were: at New York, gold, $2,416; Baltimore, none; New Orleans, none; San Francisco, $214.

The damage by steamer is insignificant, but it is difficult to state the relative percentage. It is probably one tenth as great as that by sailing vessels. We have thus virtually paid from two hundred thousand to three hundred and fifty thousand dollars, according to rate of duty, for maintaining sailing vessels, two thirds of them foreign, driven from the European trade by superior transportation. With first-class steamers fetching coffee, this would be saved. We have had the refuse trade and paid this sum. If wisely applied, it would have built up our commerce with Brazil permanently through steamships.

In every point of view, perfect steamship service with Brazil is important, but it cannot be had without the patronage of the Government. Foreign nations can obtain equal speed and capacity with two thirds of the capital employed and two thirds of the running expenses; still they grant large mail pay in addition, satisfied that it is returned manifold into their treasuries.

Our Government has paid the Brazil line, for mail pay, a little over one dollar per mile-$150,000 for one hundred and forty-three thousand miles of service. They have received even less than this from Brazil. This is much less than we have granted to other important lines, and experience shows that it is not enough. Brazil is not likely to grant any more than she pays now. With creditable energy the Brazil company propose double service for in

creased pay, instead of asking higher pay for service necessarily disjointed. They have also adopted our view to include two steamers of twenty-five hundred tons each, in the tonnage employed, so as to provide ample capacity.

Your committee are of opinion that the extension of this service is a practical necessity to retain our present commerce with Brazil and to assert natural claims for extended commerce and pay for necessary imports with our own produce and manufactures. They do not ask for unreasonable mail pay, and we recommend the passage of the accompanying bill, which grants the least compensation that will maintain proper service on a footing of justice to all.

Before the reading of the report was concluded,

Mr. CHANDLER. I am not particular to hear that report. I thought it was a report

from the Post Office Committee.

Mr. NYE. It is.

Mr. CHANDLER. I beg your pardon. That is taken from the Commercial Relations. Those things are very familiar. I have been listening for something from the Post Office Committee. I wish the Post Office report; that is on commerce. I want to hear from the Post Office Committee. [Laughter.]

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair will state that the Secretary is reading from a report of the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, submitted by the Senator from Minnesota, [Mr. RAMSEY,] its chairman.

Mr. CHANDLER. Everything there is familiar to me, and hence it is not worth while to read any more from that report. I should have been glad to hear something about the Post Office relations in connection with Brazil. I was perfectly aware that our imports from Brazil were thirty millions and our exports about four millions, and I never heard of any nation being very desirous of increasing that kind of traffic where it pays out six or seven dollars in coin for every dollar's worth of merchandise it sends out. I was likewise perfectly aware that this line brought into the Treasury some four million dollars duty on coffee; but it did not make a difference of one sixpence to the Treasury whether the coffee came in sailing ships or in these steamships. I was likewise aware that this same steamship company applied for a bounty of twenty dollars a ton on all the coffee brought by the line. I told them that I did not know that it made any difference to the consumers of coffee in the United States whether that coffee came by their steamship line or by sailing ships from Brazil.

Mr. President, I am utterly opposed to this scheme; and unless the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads have something to say about Post Office business, I will thank them not to lecture the Committee on Commerce about our commercial relations.

Mr. NYE. Perhaps some of the rest of us are not quite so fortunate as our distinguished friend from Michigan. Those that are not I think would like to hear this report read through. If the Committee on Commerce knew about this before they have not told us of it. We are glad to get it second-handed. Mr. COLE. If the chairman of the Committee on Commerce will substitute some report relating to the commerce of the country for this I should like to hear it. I presume he has put forth in his official capacity as chairman of that committee some report in favor of encouraging the commerce of the country.

Mr. CHANDLER. Certainly I have. I presented a bill from the Committee on Commerce something more than a year ago that would have given us five lines of steamships, and six ships to the line, and three-thousand ton ships. We should have had thirty steamships of three thousand tons each on the ocean to-day had you adopted the recommendations

of that committee.

Mr. NYE. I think we had better hear this report. It is very interesting.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Secretary will continue the reading of the report. The Chief Clerk continued and concluded the reading of the report.

Mr. CHANDLER. Is a motion in order to amend the amendment?

The PRESIDING OFFICER, (Mr. FERRY, of Michigan, in the chair.) The Committee on Appropriations have proposed an amendment to their reported amendment, which is in the second degree. An amendment in the third degree would not be admissible.

Mr. CHANDLER. Then I hope the amendment and the amendment to the amendment will both be voted down. The amendment to the amendment is $50,000 worse than the amendment, and the amendment is $100,000 too much. I desire at the proper time to offer an amendment making the service double what it now is; that is, voting $300,000 a year for semi-monthly trips. That gives them $12,500 a trip; and where a steamer cannot run with $12,500 a trip bonus for the voyage, I do not think it can be a very profitable traffic.

With regard to the $4,000,000 paid into the Treasury by this line, it will be remembered that that was wholly on coffee. We have now repealed the duty on coffee entirely; and as we are paying for the coffee in coin, I do not think it worth while to pay a subsidy to a steamship line to bring that coffee when sailing vessels are waiting in great numbers to transport it without bounty.

Mr. RAMSEY. My honorable friend from Michigan is very auxious to know the postal revenues derived from our communication with Brazil. I will give him the figures. The Postmaster General states that owing to the imperfection of the service"-the infrequency of the service I suppose he means-"the result is that a majority of the letters from the United States for Brazil are forwarded in the British mail via Southampton, reaching their destination by that circuitous route sooner than if detained a month for transmission by the next direct steamer from New York to Rio de Janeiro." The mail going out once a month and returning but once a month is too infrequent to stimulate correspondence, and hence most of the letters pass by the English line. In the year 1869-70 the letters exchanged with Brazil numbered 166,000, and the postal receipts were $20,315 29. In 1870-71, owing to the more frequent arrivals and departures of the British mail service, the number fell off to 98.487 letters and the postal receipts were $13,276 59.

Mr. CHANDLER. According to that we paid $150,000 out of the Treasury to get $20,000 in. That may be a profitable business with the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, but the Committee on Commerce are not very much in the habit of considering that sort of exchange as beneficial to the Treasury. We like to see at least the account nearly balanced.

Mr. RAMSEY. The Senator ought certainly to know that $1,000 of postal revenue means more than $1,000,000 in the Treasury through the custom-house. Through your correspondence you stimulate your trade.

You

do not want to get all your revenue to carry on the Government out of the postal correspondence. It is a means to an end; that is all. Mr. CHANDLER. I accept the lecture. The Committee on Commerce will turn over their business to the Senator's committee, and when the Committee on Commerce exchanges and becomes a Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, I guaranty it will attend to post offices and post roads, and when any commercial matter comes before the committee it will refer it to the proper committee.

Mr. SAWYER. It seems to be the understood policy of the Government that the sub

United States and Brazil shall be maintained. We already have a contract for twelve trips a year, at $12,500 a trip. The proposition is to increase it to twenty-four trips a year, increasing the compensation or subsidy $300,000, making a total of $450,000 as the annual subsidy.

Now, I call attention to the circumstance that if it is worth while to maintain this line of communication with Brazil at all, it is worth while to make it effectual. It is evident that at present, with a length of voyage which it requires twenty-six to twenty-eight days to perform, a very large amount of the advantages of the line are lost to American trade. But three or four days at the outside are left at each end of the line for answering letters and for filling orders, and the result is that a large portion of the replies to corre spondents and of the responses to orders for merchandise, &c., are couveyed through foreign lines of steamers.

But I will pass by that point, which is obvious to any one who will consider it, to the amount of the subsidy. The subsidy which we give to the Pacific mail steamship line is about three dollars per mile. If we give the $450,000 which it is proposed by the amend ment of the committee to give to this line, it will be less than $1 80 a mile, and I think not much over $1 70 a mile.

Mr. WEST. Oue dollar and sixty-six cents. Mr. SAWYER. Now there are a great many steam lines running from European ports to the Brazilian ports. They are gradually taking more and more of the commerce of the world with Brazil and taking it away from the United States. Our commerce is in a fair way of being taken out of our hands, so far as it exists between Brazil and the United States. Now, I say if this line is worth maintaining at all, let us maintain it so that it can exist and do us some good. As it at present exists with the present subsidy, it is neither profitable to the persons who carry on the commerce, to those who own the lines of steamships, nor is it of any special advantage to the United States.

The reasons for its not being advantageous to the United States are, as is believed by the Committee on Appropriations, and as is believed by the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, in the fact that it is a monthly service on a long line. We are attempting to do something to revive American commerce. This is one of the steps which it has seemed fit to two committees of the Senate to take in order to aid American commerce. It is but a drop in the bucket compared with what other nations do in subsidizing steamship lines to aid in their own commerce, and I trust that the opposition of the chairman of the Committee on Commerce to this subsidy will not prevail with the Senate until he gives better reasons for that opposition than that the postage derived from the line is not enough to pay the amount of subsidy. We do not, as has been well said by the chairman of the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, expect that this subsidy will be repaid into the Treasury of the United States by the amount of postages on letters which are carried in these vessels; but we do expect to extend American commerce over the great field of South America; we do expect to increase the exports from the United States, so that those which we send out from this country to Brazil shall be more than four per cent. of all that she receives from the world.

The fact is to day that we send her something less than four per cent. of her imports; and this, considering the position of the United States with regard to Brazil, considering her capacity to receive the products of the United States, is simply disgraceful, if it is in our power to increase the amount which we send to her. We believe that it is in our power to increase largely the amount of the importations of the

products of the United States by Brazil. We believe that instead of paying for a large portion of the merchandise which we receive from her in the precious metals we may pay for them in our manufactured products. We believe this subsidy which is proposed by the Committee on Appropriations in this Post Office appropriation bill is one of the steps to that end, that we may have at least one line of stemships which will be maintained with sufficient frequency to serve the proper ends of a postal line between the United States and Brazil.

Mr. NYE. My friend from Michigan often tempts me to think it is strange that a man from the mountains should take any interest in commerce. The locality of the State which I have the honor in part to represent is mountainous, and yet it forms a part of this great nation. It is neither too high nor too low to feel a warm sympathy with every interest that is beneficial to this country. Therefore, I shall be excused, notwithstanding my unfor tunate locality, if I occupy the attention of the Senate for a few minutes on this question.

Two or three things are perfectly visible. One is that the commerce we used to possess has gone away. Now, sir, I am not going to stop to inquire into the causes. They are multifarious, and as many different things in in regard to the causes exist as there are dif ferent individuals to talk about them; but the fact stands out, nevertheless, that our commerce is dwarfed and dwarfing. As an Amer ican citizen, and as one of the representatives of the people and the interests of this nation, I feel it my duty on all occasions to put forth every laudable exertion to reinstate it, for I know, and the Senate knows, that a great nation is impossible without a great commerce, and that owing to the peculiar situation of our own country, geographically, a great commerce is ours if our opportunities are properly husbanded.

My friend complains that this report did not come from the Committee on Commerce. Mr. President, this nation has begged on its knees for eight years to my certain knowledge that Congress should stretch forth its hand to resurrect, if possible, the commerce of our country. They have been answered by nothing till the country, with the highest respect and regard for that commerce, have looked in vain for any relief from that source; and it is from other committees, especially from the Committee on Post Offices and Post Roads, so nearly connected with our commerce as to be inseparable, that relief has been proposed. The Post Office Committee have charge of the veinous circulation that pervades internally as well as externally the whole country-the mails; and the Committee on Commerce com plain that they supply these little rivulets that flow naturally to their committee. All this is very well; but where is the relief to commerce?

I do not share in the apprehension of the honorable Senator from Indiana [Mr. MORTON] when he told us yesterday that subsidies would not do at this time. Sir, for more than eight years I have stood here and I have been told that story every time there was an effort put forth to aid commerce: "It will not do now. Sir, when will it do? Is it better to resurrect the dead than to try to save the living? Sir, it will do, and this nation demands more loudly now than anything else that the power of Congress shall be exercised in an honest effort to rebuild the commerce of our country. I do not share in the apprehension of the honorable Senator from Indiana that the people will frown upon it. Sir, the people will sustain everything in this country that tends to ennoble us and to make us grander and more important in the eyes of the world.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator's time has expired.

Mr. NYE. I would like about two minutes

more.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair hears no objection, and the Senator will proceed.

Mr. NYE. Sir, the people will approve of any honest effort that is made by Congress to rebuild our wasted commerce. They have looked here until their eyes have got tired of looking for aid, because every proposition that has been made for an honest effort has been either hooted down or laughed at. For one I am sick of this. I am for making efforts; I would reach our arms out from Brazil to the Pacific coast by the way of New York. I would endow these lines with millions, if it were necessary, to try the experiment, and see whether we have got to yield the point for ever that we are again never to be a commercial nation. Are we to wait for the Committee on Commerce longer? My honorable friend from Michigan tells us that four or five years ago he introduced a bill here from the Committee on Commerce.

Mr. CHANDLER. Last year.

Mr. NYE. Last year; and if it had been put upon its passage he has a vision in which he sees thirty ships floating now, six lines and five ships to each! Mr. President, a beautiful vision, that! It was conceived and born, I suppose, by him; but where are the ships? Where is the first one that has been built? It sleeps the sleep that knows no waking. My honorable friend says it is not his fault. He will bear me witness that he has not moved it this year, and five long months have we been here and a withering commerce has been at his door and his ear every hour.

Sir, this talk never will build a ship. It is not talk that builds vessels; it is inducements held out to men of enterprise to strike off on the sea and try it, and, sir, that Government is not true to itself which does not aid them. It is not true to its own interests commercially, it is not true to its own interests financially, if it refuses to do it. I differ in toto with the policy of the timid in this respect. I say that our commerce is the very pulsation of our national heart. Let us keep the pulsation strong; let the blood flow to the extreme points where ships go, and by Government aid if it is necessary, until they are so strongly established that the capital of other nations shall not undermine them by heavier help than we give our own.

The honorable Senator from Kentucky [Mr. STEVENSON] yesterday read us a homily about the Collins line. Why, sir, what were the facts about that? Steam navigation was then in its infancy, and a wasteful extravagance pervaded the whole management of that concern. One ship, the Adriatic, as she lay at the wharf, cost more than a million dollars. I recollect very well the history of the Collins line, and our country let go just when it should have held on; another appropriation would have established that line so that to day our full quota of ships would be seen flying our own flag from the masts at our great national metropolis.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator's time has expired.

Mr. MORTON. Mr. President, when it is proposed to grant a subsidy for the purpose of opening up a new commerce, establishing a commerce where there is none, that is one question. But where it is proposed to grant a subsidy to a steamship line between countries where there is already an enormous commerce, and that commerce rapidly increasing from causes which we all understand, that is another question. Now, this report shows that in 1865 two hundred and thirty-eight vessels from Brazil entered our ports; and in the fiscal year 1870-71 the entries were five hundred and five; so that the tonnage has more than doubled in five years. Here is an enormous commerce already existing. Here is a steamship line six years old, and yet we are told it cannot increase its service from monthly to semi-monthly trips without an enhanced subsidy. If that is

so, it is because of reasons that show we cannot build up our commerce or sustain it by mere subsidies.

If it is proper to grant a subsidy to a steam. ship line between here and Brazil where there is now an increase to six hundred ships a year each way, as we are told, for the same reason we should subsidize lines between New York and Liverpool where there is already an enorm. ous commerce. No, Mr. President, you cannot revive your commerce by means of subsidy in a case like this. So far as the pretense that it is for increased mail service is concerned, that is not a good one. There is a monthly service by this line, but I am informed there are mails sent out from week to week by other lines and by other ships. There is weekly mail service; it may be semi-weekly or tri-weekly for all I know. There is only monthly service, however, by this line.

Now, let it be understood that this is a case where it is proposed to increase the subsidy between two countries where there is already an enormous commerce, and if this steamship line, with the enormous carrying trade between Brazil and the United States, cannot sustain itself without a subsidy, we cannot afford to sustain it by a subsidy. There is the same

reason for a subsidy to sustain lines between this country and every other where there is already an enormous commerce.

The subsidy for the line between California and China and Japan was first put upon the ground that we should build up a commerce where none existed. Here there is an existing commerce, an enormous commerce, bound largely to increase, because this report says that we have added four millions to the coffee consumers in the United States by the abolition of slavery. We know the increase of coffee importation is large from year to year-very large last year; very large the year before and yet with all this enormous existing trade we are told that this line cannot be sustained semi-monthly without an increase of subsidy, more than doubling the subsidy.

Mr. President, it is wrong in principle, it cannot be justified upon any ground, and I am opposed to it.

Mr. STEWART. Mr. President, I think there is a good deal of difference between a subsidy to a line between New York and Brazil, and one to a line from New York to Liv erpool. I am not prepared to say that I would not vote for a subsidy between New York and Great Britain, but I am certain there is a wide difference in the two cases. Brazil is a great consumer of manufactured articles. She has not advanced in the production of those articles as Europe has; and there is a chance, if we have trade with her, to supply her with manufactured articles. We are more advanced in manufactures than Brazil. With Brazil there can be an interchange of products, because she has the raw materials, and has to buy our manufactured articles.

It is very plain that our manufacturers not stand on an equal footing with European manufacturers if the latter have speedy steam communication, because the sailing is too long to give orders for anything they want in the line of agricultural implements or things of that kind, and they must get them from Europe if they have got to have sailing vessels to bring them from the United States. There is a chance here, then, to build up a trade, and an important trade, it seems to me, and we should be very much benefited by that commerce. There are reasons why we should cultivate that trade which do not exist in regard to trade with countries in Europe.

It is admitted on all hands that our commerce must be revived, that it is important, that it increases the national wealth, and no other plan is devised but granting subsidies. It seems to me that inasmuch as we have no other plan we might try this experiment to a limited extent. Suppose we should try the experiment to the extent that Great Britain

has done of five millions a year properly distributed; it would certainly put a very large number of steamers on the ocean. It would certainly set to work a very large number of mechanics at home. It would certainly give us some ship yards. It would certainly give us ship yards that would form a nucleus for building a navy when we want it. The total amount asked for all the companies, all the subsidies asked for, does not reach half the sum that Great Britain is now giving with all her other advantages of cheap labor and low tariffs.

Now, let us do something in this line to place our enterprising people upon a level with Great Britain. Let us, if we can, do something to place them where they stood before the war, before Great Britain commenced this extensive system of subsidies. Then there was about the same difference between labor in the two countries as there is now; and there was a great difference on account of the relative tariffs of the two countries; but still we could compete with her. Now, however, our people are called on to compete with Great Britain in this matter of subsidies. Great Britain gives her lines of steamships an advantage that we have not got and never have had. That advantage we can remove without disturbing the tariff laws. We can remove it by resorting to the same means she does, and to put on this increased line between this country and Brazil it seems to me would be very important. It would give our mechanics a chance to compete with those of Europe in the markets of Brazil, where they need manufactured articles, where they need the results of our inventive genius. It would give our people a chauce, and for want of that chance we hear constant complaints. A semi-monthly line of steamers would be a very considerable aid to them in this regard, cultivating the trade of a people that are numerous, growing, and a country on the American continent. I think it would have a tendency to develop that trade, and I think it important at all events to try it, as long as there is a universal cry in this country for the revival of commerce, and no other plan is presented by anybody except to subsidize these lines. This plan is working in England. I shall vote for reasonable subsides for all the lines. I am willing to try the experiment. There may be something else wiser and better, but until it comes the only thing that we can do to aid commerce is to vote for this proposition.

Mr. POMEROY. This precise proposition if it has not been amended I do not think I can vote for. If it were proposed to double the service or double the present subsidy, I think I would vote for that; but this is more. I will not vote for this as it now is; but if it is put at $300,000, I will.

Mr. FRELINGHUYSEN. Mr. President, I shall vote against all these subsidies; and I wish very briefly, within the five minutes allowed me, to state my reasons.

I had a weakness for the Pacific mail subsidy yesterday, and I should have liked to vote for it; but when the only possible reason that I could see which authorized us to vote the money out of the Treasury, which was to provide sailors for our Navy, was voted down, and we were told it was discriminating against race and class and previous condition to have men as seamen that were citizens, and over whom we had some control in case there came a war, and that those lines must be manned by Chinese, when one American or Englishman would be a match for half a dozen of them, then I voted against it.

There is another thing in that section to which I ask the attention of the Senate. As I understand that section as it has passed, it really takes away rights that this Government had. Under the existing law we have a right, for the subsidy we pay for a monthly service of the mail, in case they put on another line, to have a semi-monthly service;